Cauterize Album Chart Positions

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julio
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Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by julio »

We should be getting debut album chart positions for various countries.

I have the following:

Australia: 34
New Zealand: 34
UK: 23
Germany: 34
Netherlands: 15
US: 34 on Billboard (but Hits daily Double has them at 16 with 14,445 sold, #29 at 14,990 including streaming)

Cauterize is doing better than All I Was which is a positive sign. For Ref, All I was charted at 29 (with 12k copies sold) in the US.
Last edited by julio on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Fish Tacos »

Really expected a larger delta than 2500. I wouldn't have thought so but I think Tim is right when he talks about leaks damaging sales.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by chtimixeur »

Leaks happen to every artist, and they have for the past 15 years.
If someone wants to buy the album, he will, but if he doesn't want to buy it, he won't no matter what.
Spotify does much more damage to sales IMO.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Timotheus »

If I got 200.000 people to listen to my record and only have 15.000 of them buy it, I'd be stoked as hell. Mostly because I got to reach all those people.
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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Fish Tacos »

What good is reaching them if they didn't like it enough? "Success" rate would be more important to me.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Timotheus »

Fish Tacos wrote:What good is reaching them if they didn't like it enough? "Success" rate would be more important to me.
A lot of people don't have money to buy everything they like. They'll like it enough to listen to it on a streaming site multiple times or even illegally download it, and when the band's in town they'll attend the show. Do you really think all those people that went to the arena tours in the UK bought Fortress or AB III?
Last edited by Timotheus on Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by erv »

I stream most of my music, as I won;t be able to buy all I listen to. I buy tremonti and especially alter bridge blindfolded though. But then, after the purchase, most of my listening happens through a streaming service.

A band needs exposure as much as sales. I encourage sales, yes, but most of the music I listen to is stuff I wouldn't have even bought and therefore heard and subsequently supported any other way.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Mr. Slash »

I think Mark should start a drunken fight at an airport or something to get some publicity.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Fish Tacos »

Timotheus wrote:
Fish Tacos wrote:What good is reaching them if they didn't like it enough? "Success" rate would be more important to me.
A lot of people don't have money to buy everything they like. They'll like it enough to listen to it on a streaming site multiple times or even illegally download it, and when the band's in town they'll attend the show. Do you really think all those people that went to the arena tours in the UK bought Fortress or AB III?

Of course I don't. I just assume that there's X percentage of new folks that will wind up financially supporting a band based on the number Y of people that are exposed to it.

X * ΔY = 2500 just seems low to me. But I think my problem is I'm putting too much emphasis on first week sales. Five Finger Death Punch's (:/) first album sold 3800 copies the first week but was eventually certified gold. Granted they sell over 90,000 first week copies now but like I said I think I'm putting too much emphasis on it.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Timotheus »

Yea, I agree Mark's numbers are quite disappointing. On the other hand, his tour seems to be going really well, as far as I can tell.
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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by coldenscence »

#40 on US Billboard... I thought it'd be much higher than this. At least in top 20
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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by chtimixeur »

The Billboard website says #34
http://www.billboard.com/charts/billboard-200

Even though it's a cool album, if Mark wants to get higher, he'll have to shake things up a bit in the future.
No more Elvis, and no more playing it safe in the song structure department...
But who am I kidding ? It won't happen, and we all know it.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Dolo »

chtimixeur wrote: Even though it's a cool album, if Mark wants to get higher, he'll have to shake things up a bit in the future.
No more Elvis, and no more playing it safe in the song structure department...
But who am I kidding ? It won't happen, and we all know it.
To get higher, he needs to do exactly the opposite. An album full of Sympathies would definitely lift him up in the ranking.
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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by chtimixeur »

One way or the other, he needs to change something.
Since 2007, it somewhat feels like he's releasing albums with the exact same blueprint.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by julio »

The Billboard chart includes both Album Sales and Album Streams. Cauterized didn't have a lot streaming. They are ranked higher if you only compare album sales.


Not Billboard, but you can see the difference.
Just Sales (#16): http://hitsdailydouble.com/building_album_chart
Sales + Streaming (#29): http://hitsdailydouble.com/sales_plus_streaming

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Mr. Slash »

chtimixeur wrote:The Billboard website says #34
http://www.billboard.com/charts/billboard-200

Even though it's a cool album, if Mark wants to get higher, he'll have to shake things up a bit in the future.
No more Elvis, and no more playing it safe in the song structure department...
But who am I kidding ? It won't happen, and we all know it.
whats the problem with elvis?

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Ubik »

Oh great, Elvis discussions :lol

I wasn't really expecting anything much higher, the singles tend to hover at around the same level as well. Disappointed with the UK figure though given how much we tend to lap up Alter Bridge, but there's not been much about in exposure terms (I really think a better lead single would've helped too).
For all of the hope that it brings...

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Fish Tacos »

Nobody ever seems to talk about marketing when they discuss going up in the rankings. I wonder if a larger piece of budget was given to marketing endeavors if it would make a difference.

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by anguyen92 »

So where would the money go towards if they want to put more into marketing? Marketing research?

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Re: Cauterize Album Chart Positions

Post by Fish Tacos »

I was thinking more along the lines of advertising.

When I watched E3, the new thriller Selfless paid a buttload of money to make sure their trailer got played several times each day on a live feed with no other commercials. Twitch broke new records this year by streaming E3 (12M unique visitors over 4 days and almost 500,000 simultaneous at one point). I'm willing to bet that now a whole bunch more people are going to go see that movie regardless of if reviews say it's good or not. This is obviously a different scenario as the budget is drastically different, it's a different medium, and you're probably more likely to buy a movie ticket for a movie you're not sure about than to buy an album you're uncertain of. But I think the basic premise of advertising = good is still the same.

The "own a piece of rock history" and listening party were such unique and cool ideas to me, but they're really only going to appeal to folks that are already hardcore fans and as far as I can tell actually generated money. The interviews, podcasts and articles are great as well, but unless I'm mistaken, those are free. I know very little of how the music industry works, but I think the bands have to pay to go on tour then try to recoup a profit in ticket sales, so they probably view that as advertising, and it is, but I wonder if they got some radio spots during the rush hour home or took out digital ad space or took a percentage of their budget and spent it on one of 10 other things I can't think of, if it might help the ranking.

I thought this was an interesting article that goes into how to calculate an advertising min and max http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/54436. In this case, I guess the markup would be the delta between the amount the band/label invested in production and distribution divided by the number of albums made versus how much they make back per album, then they'd use the 10 and 12 percent figures and the rest of the steps using the money spent on studio time as the "rent"? I read that Tremonti said they "increased the budget tremendously" this time, so according to this, that should mean that more $$ would typically be spent on advertising.

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