It'd be pretty interesting to hear whatever would come out of such cooperation. SW is indeed fantastic and he used to produce some pop music but it'd pretty hard for him to fidn time to work with anyone even if he wanted.BSC wrote:Steven Wilson is a fantastic producer, but I don't think for one second he'll want to work with Alter Bridge
Record Producers
Re: Record Producers
- Timotheus
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Re: Record Producers
I think some people look down on commercial rock/metal a lot more than on pop. I agree with BSC that AB's music probably wouldn't excite Steven. I'd be stoked if they worked together though.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
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Re: Record Producers
Terry Date or Butch Vig.
As long as they stay away from Rick Rubin, Johnny K. or Howard Benson, things should be fine.
But in the end, this debate is useless, since they're going to stay with Elvis, we all know it.
Whether it's live or in the studio, this band is afraid of taking any risk.
As long as they stay away from Rick Rubin, Johnny K. or Howard Benson, things should be fine.
But in the end, this debate is useless, since they're going to stay with Elvis, we all know it.
Whether it's live or in the studio, this band is afraid of taking any risk.
Re: Record Producers
Rick Rubin, Bob Rock, John Shanks.
I believe Slash was so impressed with the sound on III that he decided to get Elvis to produce the Conspirators. They've had practically the same sound from Blackbird onwards, and with III they just got LOUD. Even Mark's solo albums - although he claims that they are different from AB - are frankly not any different.
There's virtually no dynamics in III, Fortress and Mark's 2 records.
I want a producer who can bring in something really new to the band. Force them in a direction they have not gone before. If it means the band get less heavy, so be it.And also an engineer who does not believe that louder is better. I think Elvis and AB have got into a comfort zone and I don't think Elvis really challenges them enough.
I loved the first record. I liked BB even better. But frankly i wasn't prepared for the sonic onslaught when I hit play on my BB disc. Nor did I expect the quality of musicianship and song-writing.
With III and Fortress , I have got almost exactly what I expected. Sure there are a few things here and there that are different from BB but they've become very predictable. And this is something the band needs to change IMO.When I buy AB V, I want to get hear something that I never in a million years would expect to hear on an AB record.
I believe Slash was so impressed with the sound on III that he decided to get Elvis to produce the Conspirators. They've had practically the same sound from Blackbird onwards, and with III they just got LOUD. Even Mark's solo albums - although he claims that they are different from AB - are frankly not any different.
There's virtually no dynamics in III, Fortress and Mark's 2 records.
I want a producer who can bring in something really new to the band. Force them in a direction they have not gone before. If it means the band get less heavy, so be it.And also an engineer who does not believe that louder is better. I think Elvis and AB have got into a comfort zone and I don't think Elvis really challenges them enough.
I loved the first record. I liked BB even better. But frankly i wasn't prepared for the sonic onslaught when I hit play on my BB disc. Nor did I expect the quality of musicianship and song-writing.
With III and Fortress , I have got almost exactly what I expected. Sure there are a few things here and there that are different from BB but they've become very predictable. And this is something the band needs to change IMO.When I buy AB V, I want to get hear something that I never in a million years would expect to hear on an AB record.
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Re: Record Producers
I'm going to respectfully disagree here. I don't mind not being surprised when it comes to AB. There are certain things I want in an Alter Bridge album and they keep providing it to me, album after album. Elvis has a great grasp of what these guys are capable of and he keeps bringing it out of them.joey78 wrote: With III and Fortress , I have got almost exactly what I expected. Sure there are a few things here and there that are different from BB but they've become very predictable. And this is something the band needs to change IMO.When I buy AB V, I want to get hear something that I never in a million years would expect to hear on an AB record.
I think, and some people may not know it, but there are going to be times where bands will experiment with their sound and they will fail at the approach they are going for. I mean people have fairly criticized Breaking Benjamin's new album to be a bit derivative compared to their past albums, but damn it, Dark Before Dawn was an honest-to-good album that I expected Breaking Benjamin to bring out and that's what I wanted.
I do not want AB, at this critical juncture in their careers where everything keeps becoming a little undefined regarding their future, to experiment and fail and which could result in a bad song. Some people may be fine with it, in hopes that they "improve" in the future, I'm not. I just an honest-to-good, well-crafted Alter Bridge album and if it means working with the same producer in the form of Elvis and that they are not "experimenting" enough in the ways people wanted, so be it.
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Greatness doesn't come from habits and playing it safe. Knowing what they can do and what they've done in the past, goodness is not enough for me. From artists like Slash and Tremonti that's ok, but AB is so much more than that, in my opinion.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
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All right, care to comment on the "there are going to be times where bands will experiment with their sound and they will probably fail at the approach they are going for." comment? I believed Metallica's collaboration with Lou Reed on Lulu was technically an experiment for them and no one liked it at all, including me and I'm a guy that don't mind it when Metallica was changing their sounds after The Black Album, because they still manage to deliver the goods on certain songs (just not all of the songs though).
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That's a bit of an extreme example and that wasn't even a Metallica album.
I wouldn't mind if they failed at an album once trying to experiment, but honestly I don't think they'd ever go that far.
I wouldn't mind if they failed at an album once trying to experiment, but honestly I don't think they'd ever go that far.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
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Re: Record Producers
Concept album would be pretty sweet, Mark and Myles conceptual-story telling lyrics and some awesome music to go along with it. idk it could work, i've always wanted something like that from alter bridge.
but yeah, producer wise, i dont think we're gonna get a non-elvis record for a while. would be cool to be surprised but it works so im not complaining.
but yeah, producer wise, i dont think we're gonna get a non-elvis record for a while. would be cool to be surprised but it works so im not complaining.
Thanks Timo!
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To be fair, taking risks doesn't have to be with a new producer. Radiohead has used the same producer since OK Computer and they reinvented themselves every single album.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
Re: Record Producers
I just don't want them to pull a Linkin Park. I respect what Linkin Park did but definitely haven't really listened to them since.
Re: Record Producers
I know zilch about producers and mixers but searched to see who did Superunknown. Michael Beinhorn has had a heck of an interesting career. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Beinhorn
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Kasper too
http://www.adamkasper.net/discography.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Kasper too
http://www.adamkasper.net/discography.html
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Re: Record Producers
agny wrote:I know zilch about producers and mixers but searched to see who did Superunknown. Michael Beinhorn has had a heck of an interesting career. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Beinhorn
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Kasper too
http://www.adamkasper.net/discography.html
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Re: Record Producers
I think Johnny K or David Bendeth would be great producer/engineers for them to work with. Honestly, I really like what Elvis does on the production and even the mix. What I'd really like to see them do is get a different mastering engineer. Ted Jensen is considered one of the best, but it seems like everything he does is at bleeding ears loudness. Its fatiguing to listen to, and I would love to hear the songs breathe where they are meant to.
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Re: Record Producers
I keep hearing Ted Jensen's name a lot when it comes to mastering albums. So what does his job do that's different from what Elvis and Jef Moll do in the production sense?
Last edited by anguyen92 on Sat Jul 25, 2015 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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^ Are you asking what the difference between mastering and mixing is? Or are you asking the difference between the results of those persons?
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
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The difference between mastering and mixing. But I guess, if you're mentioning it, I want to know the answer to the 2nd question then.
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Mixing is done on all the individual instruments and vocals beforehand. It contains EQ'ing, panning, balancing the volume between all the individual tracks, compression on the individual tracks, effects (reverb, delay, etc) and a lot more. The idea of mixing is to get the mix as good sounding as possible.
Mastering is the phase that comes afterwards. Mastering is done on the master track (hence the name). First there's compression to make the track consistent in terms of dynamics (ideally with still enough range for the instruments to breathe). Afterwards they usually turn up the volume of the entire thing so the song can "compete" with other music out there. That's where the loudness war started and everything went wrong. When you put a lot of compression on a track and then turn the volume up it's just loudness all the time and there's no room for the instruments to breathe.
It's also important in the mastering stage to get the volume of all the songs on an album on a consistent level so people don't have to turn up or down the volume between songs.
There's more to mastering, but in short that's pretty much it.
Mastering is the phase that comes afterwards. Mastering is done on the master track (hence the name). First there's compression to make the track consistent in terms of dynamics (ideally with still enough range for the instruments to breathe). Afterwards they usually turn up the volume of the entire thing so the song can "compete" with other music out there. That's where the loudness war started and everything went wrong. When you put a lot of compression on a track and then turn the volume up it's just loudness all the time and there's no room for the instruments to breathe.
It's also important in the mastering stage to get the volume of all the songs on an album on a consistent level so people don't have to turn up or down the volume between songs.
There's more to mastering, but in short that's pretty much it.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.
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So, something like for those that bought the Cauterize album at Best Buy. We noticed that there was a huge difference in volume between Providence (the official last track) and the live track of You Waste Your Time (the start of the B-sides portion of the album) where I had to turn it up a great amount for You Waste Your Time. That was due to a mastering error?
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I think they were mastered seperately and the live versions were just pasted at the end of the album.
anguyen92 wrote:Oh well. Deal with it.