New Tension in the Band

[julio]

Every Creed tour is on fragile ground. Meaning, we are one Stapp "falling off the wagon" incident away from the tour being cancelled. That is kind of scary. Fortunately, Stapp has an amazing wife who looks after him. But even that hasn't worked in the past (as he says in his book).

[Ryan]

Along with that Andy, people put emotion to music and experiences. So it makes it more personal. We can all hear a song and remember a time in our lives while hearing it...we can even remember how we felt, smells, etc..

[chtimixeur]

Why call him anything? If you wanted to quit your job I wouldn't call you anything. He doesn't owe you anything.

You're saying exactly what I said. I can call you anything, but it's your life. That's what I meant, sweet.

And he doesn't owe you anything too.

I've never bought this argument.
IMHO, popular musicians in a succesful band owe their fans EVERYTHING. Without them, they wouldn't have millions and mansions.
For instance, Metallica have used this "we don't owe you anything" argument for 2 decades, and despite releasing crappy records, they're still happy to see thousands of fans every night. Those fans aren't coming for their new songs : they're coming for the old school stuff, when the band knew was they were doing.
The same can be said about a lot of bands, including Creed.

Most ridiculous statement ever.

Music is a bought and sold product. Just like your phone, your computer, your car.

I go to the car lot, bought my car from Dave. Dave decides he wants to leave the dealership. I don't have to suddenly hate my car. I don't have to hate Dave for leaving the dealership either. Doesn't mean Dave owes me anything. He still got a hefty commission off the purchase of my car.

I paid a ton of money for Creed stuff. Tremonti is done with the band. I don't suddenly hate past Creed material, but I don't have to hate Mark for wanting to move on. He doesn't owe me anything, he still got a hefty commission off his time served.

Same difference.

No need to be condescendant, because quite frankly, I am not sure your analogy makes much sense.
For me, as soon as money is involved, a musician owes a little bit of something to his fans.
If Mark did Creed for free and didn't get any money from it, he would be entitled to say "I don't owe you guys sh*t : this is my music, and I do what I want with it, whether you like it or don't". But that is not the case, as Andy92 said, it's a business at the end of the day.
That's why I'm pissed when he's playing old Creed songs on a faster tempo, or with a bad guitar tone. People have PAID to see a performance. They have PAID to hear a band recreate, at the best of their abilities, songs they love. And the band, whether they're bad at their job, or they're changing the songs on purpose, are not delivering what is expected from them.

I know it's an artistic business, and one can't always expect an artist to be at 100% every night.
But all I'm saying is Creed has a huge fan of dedicated fans, and the least Mark could do would be to do his best at recreating a Creed vibe on concert or in the studio. And it seems to me he's doing everything he can to NOT do that (bad tones, guitar tuning, tempo issues, lack of groove, producer choices...).
If you add all those little things up, it feels like Creed has not properly returned yet.
They still have huge potential as a band, but unless they decide to give this reunion their full attention, I'm not sure Creed will ever come back.

[psycosquirrel789]

Who the hell is Dave?

[Ashlee]

Okay. We just see it differently. I see it as basic economics. Once money is exchanged and I took the product I got what I was owed. You feel entitled.

You gave money, took the product, and are STILL owed something for having simply patronized. /sigh.

[Andy92]

I think now this is becoming a difference of paying for a CD and paying for a live concert. CDs never change, but live shows are different every night. I don't really buy tickets to live shows to hear exact replications of the CDs though. If that were the case, we'd be paying to watch robots play.

[Ashlee]

It hasn't though. I bought the ticket and already went to the show. I don't expect anything else.

What I'm understanding is chtimixeur is expecting more shows and more albums predicated on the fact that the members of Creed have nice homes and money because chtimixeur previously purchased CDs, merchandise and concert tickets.

I feel like the obligation ends once the product is exchanged. I don't feel like they have to keep producing because I've purchased in the past. If that makes any sense. I know I'm making it really, really simple in scope, but considering the emotion behind music it can get overly complicated.

[Andy92]

I know what you're saying. It's the "you wouldn't be where you are without fans, so you owe us what we want" mentality. All of that's a fine line really. That kind of attitude from fans can put artistic chokes on musicians, but it's also nice when musicians respect the opinions of fans.

But honestly, it's impossible for musicians to give into the wants of all their fans because every fan would like something different. I'm generally fine with just letting artists do their own thing. If I like what they're doing, I'll keep buying CDs. If I don't like the new direction, I just won't listen to them anymore.

[AustinH22]

Stapp WAS a good singer back in the MOP/HC days but now he's a bad singer with an ego problem.

[George]

You forgot to add an "IMO".

[JaredWard]

with an ego problem.

He's always had a self proclaimed ego problem.

[Jhenrid]

I know what you're saying. It's the "you wouldn't be where you are without fans, so you owe us what we want" mentality. All of that's a fine line really. That kind of attitude from fans can put artistic chokes on musicians, but it's also nice when musicians respect the opinions of fans.

But honestly, it's impossible for musicians to give into the wants of all their fans because every fan would like something different. I'm generally fine with just letting artists do their own thing. If I like what they're doing, I'll keep buying CDs. If I don't like the new direction, I just won't listen to them anymore.

+1 Same reason why I don't listen to linkin park anymore.

[olof79]

European Radio sure do hate Creed (+Stapp) and make it perfectly clear everytime its/they are brought up in any context. The people though have a pretty open view on the postgrunge era as a whole, its mostly the media and establishment.

[One Drew Remains]

I agree with Austin. Stapp was a "polarizing" figure on stage back that era. Call it blasphemy, but he had (at the time) a "modern day Jim Morrison" thing going on. That voice was amazing. Emphasis on WAS.

Now I'm an AB fan first and foremost. But if Creed makes the guys happy, then I hope they do it. There are a dozen or so Creed songs that I think are amazing. I'm just hoping they can make more songs like What If and Ode.

[chtimixeur]

he had (at the time) a "modern day Jim Morrison" thing going on.

Not just Stapp.
The whole vibe of the band made me think of a heavier version of The Doors. Mark's clean guitar tone immediately reminded me of songs like "This is the end" when I first discovered the band. You could tell the band was directly influenced by the late 60's and early 70's rock scene.
It's a shame we can't hear that classic rock vibe in Mark's music at all these days.

[Timotheus]

I'm sorry, but I think that's blasphemy.. You can definitely hear the influences, I agree about that, but a 'modern day Jim Morrison/The doors'? Makes me think of that awkward performance of Riders on the Storm on Woodstock with Robby Krieger.

[Ashlee]

I'm sorry, but I think that's blasphemy..

Comparing Scott Stapp to Jim Morrison is also imho blasphemy. The only person you can compare Scott Stapp too is an early Scott Stapp, and even then it's a stretch

[austin.]

Stapp and Morrison are my two favorite singers. I can see the resemblence, love the attitude and vibes they each put off. However, two totally different people. Read No One Here Gets Out Alive and Stapp's bio and its very obvious. Jim was an acid head with that sort of mindset. Dont see much of a psychadelic mindset in Stapp

[JaredWard]

Both Scott & Jim do have similar looks. Also Scott CAN sound like Jim... it's just a matter of getting rid of the throaty garble approach to singing. "Riders" & the verses to "Pity For A Dime" are a good example of Scott singing without most of the garble.

[AustinH22]

It's fair to compare Morrison and Stapp especially since the Doors asked Stapp to perform with them...