DUST - The Second Part

[\m/Tremonster\m/]

Holy hell, what an idiot! It's one thing to buy the album and upload it, but to outright steal a physical copy is gutless. Such a shame he had to be Canadian .

And don't pile on Tim, guys. He has done a lot to promote the band, and we should be thankful for it. And he's right about the sense of entitlement here. It's only a few days until the album is out and can be bought legally. There's no need to be impatient. We're lucky so much of it has even been released beforehand.

The right decision was made here. Those songs recently uploaded were never supposed to end up online, so there is no good reason to be listening to it or discussing it.

[Ryan]

I'll tell ya what. I've been helping run this site since 2004 and with Every. Single. Album release regarding AB or Tremonti or any other member of AB that comes out there has been a leak; and when those albums are discussed and a leak is mentioned (not even where to get it or any links posted to it) it inevitably brings posts of "where?" "hook me up" "how can I download it?" "pm me the link" etc, etc, etc. If the label, or anyone from the label, asks us to help handle it and this is how they want it handled, we oblige. Reasons for this are: we like to keep them happy, we're friends with them/some of them, we know them personally when they ask us, we want to keep us and our site out of trouble, and we like to keep the status of the only fan run site to get band members and people associated with the band posting and giving us information. We all love that information. Granted this relationship has changed a little due to the emergence of social media and how you can directly follow the band and its' members one on one (think Twitter), but we still get access to info from time to time that you don't get through those outlets.

I agree with you guys that a personal review is no different than a magazine review. So it sucks to have to remove those type of posts, but I saw a couple that were heading in the direction of "how did you get it?" which inevitably leads to the aforementioned "hook me up" posts as well.

Hopefully that can shed some light. We're people and fans too and sometimes it's hard to pull the emotions out of it when determining what posts to allow and what not to allow. It's easier to remove them all. There weren't that many earlier when that decision was made.

[phatnonphatness]

I have taken note over the last 24 hours of everyone here who has commented on stolen content from this band, my family. I am not petty , I understand the temptation but I remember everything. Steal from us and you are hurting a very young band that doesn't have a lot of money. This record is the difference of some folk being able to pay rent or not. You can steal it - a lot of people do but then you come to our backyard and throw it in our faces? I am so disappointed, again I get the temptation but to then come here to brag because you couldn't at least have some compassion for the group / dudes that you say you care for so much. I have been telling people to come here and become a part of something - this is a family and we look out for each other... or so i thought.

feel entitled? Why can't you show a little grace? Am I out of line for asking the only fan run site the has a direct relation to the band ( and one that I personally have helped fund ) for some help? If so, shame on me but if not shame on you. Really think about that.

Im around - got something to say, lets hear it. My managers cap is now officially off and I really want someone to make sense of this for me... help me see why calling me by name is ok...

FYI Shinedown uses a label services company to help police leaks - that is a fact. I have worked for them. again, another fact.

Taking the usernames down of a bunch of randoms on the internet sounds kinda petty to me.

Look, I get it. You're trying to stop people stealing from the band. It's your job. Fair enough.

But, since you know that this is a fan board, and only the most hardcore fans come here, then surely you know that anybody here listening to a leak is planning on buying the album anyway and that pretending like a leak doesn't exist is futile. Again, just makes you seem petty...

Also, this isn't your backyard. It's a fan made forum for fans to discuss the music. And that's all we were doing before you decided to start policing the place.

[nagpo]

I'll tell ya what. I've been helping run this site since 2004 and with Every. Single. Album release regarding AB or Tremonti or any other member of AB that comes out there has been a leak; and when those albums are discussed and a leak is mentioned (not even where to get it or any links posted to it) it inevitably brings posts of "where?" "hook me up" "how can I download it?" "pm me the link" etc, etc, etc. If the label, or anyone from the label, asks us to help handle it and this is how they want it handled, we oblige. Reasons for this are: we like to keep them happy, we're friends with them/some of them, we know them personally when they ask us, we want to keep us and our site out of trouble, and we like to keep the status of the only fan run site to get band members and people associated with the band posting and giving us information. We all love that information. Granted this relationship has changed a little due to the emergence of social media and how you can directly follow the band and its' members one on one (think Twitter), but we still get access to info from time to time that you don't get through those outlets.

I agree with you guys that a personal review is no different than a magazine review. So it sucks to have to remove those type of posts, but I saw a couple that were heading in the direction of "how did you get it?" which inevitably leads to the aforementioned "hook me up" posts as well.

Hopefully that can shed some light. We're people and fans too and sometimes it's hard to pull the emotions out of it when determining what posts to allow and what not to allow. It's easier to remove them all. There weren't that many earlier when that decision was made.

That's a shame to hear but thanks for explaining. I'm kind of disappointed really. I thought higher of this site.

[Crumbso]

Whelp I'll look forward to the gag being lifted come this Friday. Can't say that the way this has been handled has particularly made me feel any warmth toward the Tremonti band organisation. I can understand the reasons from the admin team though and as usual you guys have conducted yourself with respect for the members of the board.

What I've heard thus far sounds awesome and I can't wait for the CD to be blasting out in my car.

[Ashlee]

I don't speak for Tim, but I'd imagine that his comment about recognizing and recording the names of people who steal from this band isn't about legal action. It's probably about making sure that of the dozens of requests for passes, tickets and guest list requests he gets on the regular, those people aren't included.

If you can't understand how this was an attempt to lessen google searches for a leak of the album, then I can't help you with basic reasoning and logic. This wasn't a micromanagement of the fans. This was a request. I could have denied it. No one shared a link, so there was no liability on the site's part. So when you ask me why I had to comply, my simple answer is that generally, I'm not an asshole.

I hope it goes without saying that if Fret12 asked me to jump off a bridge, I wouldn't. But there's a handful of you who are asking this website to jeopardize it's relationship with this band (ie. jump off a bridge) because you're sweet little heart feels entitled to say whatever you want to say when you want to say it. The mere notion that admins should "stand up for you" is ludicrous. Especially when there is a handful of you who live to bitch and moan and complain every chance you get. By supporting statements like, "Who the fuck do you think you are." and "The fans really owe you nothing and don't exist to bend at your will." shows that you all do a pretty good job of standing up for your damn selves.

I can't name a single band (not saying there aren't any) that released half the album before it was even released. Bothers me that people can't enjoy what they have. And it bothers me that we'll go through all of this shit later again when V is released.

[TTournier]

Wait... wait.. What? what stunt?

Ok guys - here it is, once and for all we are going to have it out, roll up your sleeves kidos.

I work for the band and they are like family to me - i was a fan before I got this gig and I in fact have been coming to this board since 2004ish.... I personally take my time to come and update. I often times ask for peoples thoughts and I try to make it a reality because again, at one point it time i was on the other side - I was / am a diehard fan driving states away just to see a gig. I love these guys.

I asked Ashlee to help me control the leak - yes there was a leak, some shit head kid in Canada stole a cd from a record stores back room and uploaded it to a torrent. I have filed out the right papers with the right people and legal action will take place. rest assured - the haulix system is an amazing tool.

I have taken note over the last 24 hours of everyone here who has commented on stolen content from this band, my family. I am not petty, I understand the temptation but I remember everything. Steal from us and you are hurting a very young band that doesn't have a lot of money. This record is the difference of some folk being able to pay rent or not. You can steal it - a lot of people do but then you come to our backyard and throw it in our faces? I am so disappointed, again I get the temptation but to then came here to brag because you couldn't at least have some compassion for the group / dudes that you say you care for so much. I have been telling people to come here and become a part of something - this is a family and we look out for each other... or so i thought.

feel entitled? Why can't you show a little grace? Am I out of line for asking the only fan run site the has a direct relation to the band ( and one that I personally have helped fund ) for some help? If so, shame on me but if not shame on you. Really think about that.

Im around - got something to say, lets hear it. My managers cap is now officially off and I really want someone to make sense of this for me... help me see why calling me by name is ok...

FYI Shinedown uses a label services company to help police leaks - that is a fact. I have worked for them. again, another fact.

Did a single member here or a single one of the posts that were deleted in any way promote or provide ways to obtain the leak?

And then you say you're not petty but at the same time claim you've written our names on some sort of list as if to threaten us. Who the fuck do you think YOU are? You come on to my board - MY family when these very same people are the ones that spend their hard earned money and purchase multiple copies of a single record and keep you employed and then say you've taken note of these people for talking about the music. That's right - the music. From what I understand it, they were doing what fans do on a forum and discussing the music. Not sharing tips on how to pirate. Heck, if I'm wrong correct me but now we have no way to be sure since they've been deleted.

The fans really owe you nothing and don't exist to bend at your will. Pretty much everyone here has already bought the record. Your group has provided a service and we've paid for it. There is nothing beyond that. This was just a discussion that for some reason you felt was threatning.

"help me see why calling me by name is ok... "

What do you mean by this? The admin said it was you who wanted this taken off. And if you didn't want it to be known, you should have said so. What was the reason you didn't want to be known? Didn't want it to blow up like this? Because you knew it was wrong?

Ok -

Yes, people in this forum passed around the link - i was send Six (6) screen grabs of people PMing the link thus I asked the mods to please keep an eye on it and keep the chatter down if they could.

Who am I? I am Tim, I am the COO of the label and I manage the band - that is who I am, I thought I stated that before but maybe I / you missed it. fair enough but thats who i am.

I have to write down everyone who shared our content for 2 reasons - 1. It is by definition my job to do so and 2. A lot of people ask me for favors on this forum - These people will no longer get anything from me. its that easy. they are talking about our music that they got while hurting the band. Understandable?
I have to turn in a report - this is apart of that.

Calling me by name - read the posts from other people (some of those folks whom i have screen shots of sharing the files), this is also pretty easy to understand. I asked a mod to help be because well - i am running a label, a band and a tour at the moment all in a launch week - I didn't ask for people to start the self entitled trash talking... we all have seen an episode of Behind the Music, do you really think that makes you an expert?

You are correct in one thing, the fans owe me nothing - zero - zip - But in return I owe them nothing. Want info? want the pass to meet the guys? want to watch sound check... after show.. sorry kid, i owe you nothin thus I'm not doing anything to help ya. sorry. Shake my hand one day and put a knife in my back the next - I don't think so. I treat everyone with respect but some folks think they can get whatever they want, well they can't. You are with us or against us unfortunately - if you rip us off, you are against us man. You go into a grocery store and just walk out with a gallon of milk? no? why not? OHH because its stealing.... All I ask people to do was whats right. Morally right.

Folks who buy records from Tremonti are awesome and we treat them like gold - always have but if you think I make one dime off of Tremonti, you my friend are sadly mistaken. My work is mainly gratis because I see whats building and know the value of these boys.

Next?

[TTournier]

I have taken note over the last 24 hours of everyone here who has commented on stolen content from this band, my family. I am not petty , I understand the temptation but I remember everything. Steal from us and you are hurting a very young band that doesn't have a lot of money. This record is the difference of some folk being able to pay rent or not. You can steal it - a lot of people do but then you come to our backyard and throw it in our faces? I am so disappointed, again I get the temptation but to then come here to brag because you couldn't at least have some compassion for the group / dudes that you say you care for so much. I have been telling people to come here and become a part of something - this is a family and we look out for each other... or so i thought.

feel entitled? Why can't you show a little grace? Am I out of line for asking the only fan run site the has a direct relation to the band ( and one that I personally have helped fund ) for some help? If so, shame on me but if not shame on you. Really think about that.

Im around - got something to say, lets hear it. My managers cap is now officially off and I really want someone to make sense of this for me... help me see why calling me by name is ok...

FYI Shinedown uses a label services company to help police leaks - that is a fact. I have worked for them. again, another fact.

Taking the usernames down of a bunch of randoms on the internet sounds kinda petty to me.

Look, I get it. You're trying to stop people stealing from the band. It's your job. Fair enough.

But, since you know that this is a fan board, and only the most hardcore fans come here, then surely you know that anybody here listening to a leak is planning on buying the album anyway and that pretending like a leak doesn't exist is futile. Again, just makes you seem petty...

Also, this isn't your backyard. It's a fan made forum for fans to discuss the music. And that's all we were doing before you decided to start policing the place.

I know most of the users on this board - so i take note because I simply will no help these folks in the future. That simple.

[Ubik]

This is some major bullshit.

I buy every album Mark puts out post-Creed, the majority of which without having heard a song before hitting pre-order, ditto his DVDs. I tell other people to listen and buy. And those last few sentences apply to the vast majority that post here.

Now my name's supposedly on some list for SHOCK HORROR not being able to wait for my copy to arrive. And members that actually keep this sole active Tremonti fan board alive are condescended to in the process.

Fuck this for a game of soldiers. I'll stick to the Alter Bridge section.

[AllC392Was]

I love the band and will always support them. I've traveled hundreds of miles for a 45 minute set. I went to the Listening party last January and had a blast. High light of my life. I buy there music legally and will always do so. I have much respect for the Admins and Tim because they put a lot of effort into making something great greater.

I won't hide behind a shell. Yesterday I woke up and heard that it got leaked. As a die hard with little patience I gave it a listen... It is selfish but it honestly just made me more excited about Friday. I'm going to buy a few copies friday to give to friends.

Tim knows who I am and I hope when I see him next all is well. I know it doesn't seem like listening to a leak is supporting the band and it isn't. But I do support them with hard earned money and will always spread the word.

[Crumbso]

TTournier, I can only respectfully say that I think these long posts are hurting your relationship with a pretty large fan forum.

[TTournier]

This is some major bullshit.

I buy every album Mark puts out post-Creed, the majority of which without having heard a song before hitting pre-order, ditto his DVDs. I tell other people to listen and buy. And those last few sentences apply to the vast majority that post here.

Now my name's supposedly on some list for SHOCK HORROR not being able to wait for my copy to arrive. And members that actually keep this sole active Tremonti fan board alive are condescended to in the process.

Fuck this for a game of soldiers. I'll stick to the Alter Bridge section.

Good on you man but if your talking about unreleased songs i take it you downloaded a leak, which happens but then you talk about it in public forum on a fan site where the band goes. Do you understand how that might upset them?

Again, if you read what I wrote - I understand the temptation of downloading it, all i ask is don't shit where you eat. If I am working and telling people (actively) to come to TABN to join the community and this is the stuff they walk into, I look like a damn fool. which is what happened.

Understand I have to keep tabs on who is going what - stay with me here, I have "Peter" always asking me for passes or something special and I help him out. Now he is on a site I am push the band to, talking about unreleased music that he downloaded - why wouldn't I take note? why would I ever help him again?

Yes we are going after the leaker - thats business. My first post I called this community a family because thats how I viewed it but i guess I was wrong. Its cool man - do as you will.

[\m/Tremonster\m/]

You guys seem to think Tim is being unfair. But when you think about it, this all is justified. A kid stole a Cd and put it up online. And yet, some of you actually think this is ok to take part in. Crap like this DOES harm bands.

[austin.]

Tim. You got no screen grab from me, because I've not downloaded the leak. I will be sitting at bestbuy Friday morning waiting to buy the CD. Can't wait for it.

Not gonna eat your asshole like some, but not gonna hate either.


If you wanna include Johnson city or Nashville inaugural tour rail footage in a future video, that'd be fucking awesome.


Thanks and rock on

[austin.]

Also this is rather intense.

Looks like most of the "important" members on here are quite pissed off. No one knew prior to the leak quite HOW it got out, so can't really say they were taking part in the fact that dude stole it from a shop. More often than not, a store puts it out early, and then it happens. We would've never known dude stole it, had you not told us.

I also think it's sort of harsh to be as hard as you're being. I get it, but as a few have said, there's 20 people that post on here. Who cares about the band more than we do? Is there some hidden forum on the web that I'm unaware of? The view few who sit here and conversation about Tremonti/AB, are the die hard of die hard fans. I'm sure all of us on here have driven hours and hours to see small shows. I know I have. Hell Tim, you know I have. We are buying the album. You know our locations. You'll get sales from where we are from. I haven't heard the leak, but the sentiment is, that hell fucking yes, we can hear the new Tremonti album a few days early. The members are excited, which is a good thing. Tremonti put something out, that people are begging and, unfortunately, even stealing the CD, to hear it. That's a job well done by the band, to make people so anxious to hear it.

Considering in the past, when other albums like AB, would leak, the talk was ALOT heavier. I honestly feel like the chatter about links and such to Dust have been the least I've ever seen. I know none would be ideal, but unfortunately, that just will never be the case. I hate that everyone's been being so bitter to everyone about this. It's a shame, as I feel like all of us,including you Tim, are/were quite close.

Don't really know where I'm going with this, I know you're the head honcho, I know the work you do pays your bills, which all adults have to do, pay their bills. So I can't knock on you for doing what you have to do to make sure you have a roof over you and your families head, but, about half of the 20 people on here are now very upset, and odds are..... You're still going to get your money from them. Shame it came to this

Rock on man. Can't wait to hear the album on Friday!

[Crumbso]

Also this is rather intense.

Looks like most of the "important" members on here are quite pissed off. No one knew prior to the leak quite HOW it got out, so can't really say they were taking part in the fact that dude stole it from a shop. More often than not, a store puts it out early, and then it happens. We would've never known dude stole it, had you not told us.

I also think it's sort of harsh to be as hard as you're being. I get it, but as a few have said, there's 20 people that post on here. Who cares about the band more than we do? Is there some hidden forum on the web that I'm unaware of? The view few who sit here and conversation about Tremonti/AB, are the die hard of die hard fans. I'm sure all of us on here have driven hours and hours to see small shows. I know I have. Hell Tim, you know I have. We are buying the album. You know our locations. You'll get sales from where we are from. I haven't heard the leak, but the sentiment is, that hell fucking yes, we can hear the new Tremonti album a few days early. The members are excited, which is a good thing. Tremonti put something out, that people are begging and, unfortunately, even stealing the CD, to hear it. That's a job well done by the band, to make people so anxious to hear it.

Don't really know where I'm going with this, I know you're the head honcho, I know the work you do pays your bills, which all adults have to do, pay their bills. So I can't knock on you for doing what you have to do to make sure you have a roof over you and your families head, but, about half of the 20 people on here are now very upset, and odds are..... You're still going to get your money from them. Shame it came to this

Rock on man. Can't wait to hear the album on Friday!

Well explained I'd say.

[Ashlee]

This isn't about Mark. It's about the other people in this band who are trying to feed their kids/keep making music. Fan excitement doesn't pay their bills.

Remember last month when at least two of you important people said you'd never spend money on this band again? And you wonder why people are policing the board? It's not threats when your own words come back to bite you.

[phatnonphatness]

You are correct in one thing, the fans owe me nothing - zero - zip - But in return I owe them nothing. Want info? want the pass to meet the guys? want to watch sound check... after show.. sorry kid, i owe you nothin thus I'm not doing anything to help ya. sorry. Shake my hand one day and put a knife in my back the next - I don't think so. I treat everyone with respect but some folks think they can get whatever they want, well they can't. You are with us or against us unfortunately - if you rip us off, you are against us man . You go into a grocery store and just walk out with a gallon of milk? no? why not? OHH because its stealing.... All I ask people to do was whats right. Morally right.

See, taking an "us vs them" mentality is childish man. We listened to the album a few days earlier than you wanted us to. We're still buying the album. How does that make us rip you off? Is listening to a leak taking money out of your pockets? No, it's really not. If it is, then explain it to me. Although to be fair your attitude has made me question whether I wanna support the band if they're gonna be so petty...

You need to get with the times already, leaks happen for almost every album. There's a reason there are entire sites dedicated to leaking albums. Find a better way to deal with it rather than trying to censor people on a site that you don't own.

I also want to make it clear that I have no beef with the mods.

[austin.]

This isn't about Mark. It's about the other people in this band who are trying to feed their kids/keep making music. Fan excitement doesn't pay their bills.

Remember last month when at least two of you important people said you'd never spend money on this band again? And you wonder why people are policing the board? It's not threats when your own words come back to bite you.

I was that person that said that.


And I can assure you, on Friday, my ass will be in Best Buy parking lot waiting to buy the album.

[TTournier]

I love the band and will always support them. I've traveled hundreds of miles for a 45 minute set. I went to the Listening party last January and had a blast. High light of my life. I buy there music legally and will always do so. I have much respect for the Admins and Tim because they put a lot of effort into making something great greater.

I won't hide behind a shell. Yesterday I woke up and heard that it got leaked. As a die hard with little patience I gave it a listen... It is selfish but it honestly just made me more excited about Friday. I'm going to buy a few copies friday to give to friends.

Tim knows who I am and I hope when I see him next all is well. I know it doesn't seem like listening to a leak is supporting the band and it isn't. But I do support them with hard earned money and will always spread the word.

Chris - I can respect this. I get being pumped to hear a record and doing what you did - I understand it 100% The only thing I ask is that you don't make a bad situation worse but sharing the links. Please note I didn't personally see you do this, I am just stating the obvious.

You are a great supporter of the group and a valued fan thus you get treated as such correct?