importance of lyrics

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Tigra
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importance of lyrics

Post by Tigra »

I would like to ask you how important the lyrics are to you in your overall reception of a song, whether by AB or any other band/singer.

Most of you here are native speakers of English, I believe, so it is easier for you to know “what the song is about” after first hearing. I don’t know how non-natives feel but despite the fact that given my profession I should be quite proficient in English, still I am not able to detect all the lyrics exactly even after listening to a given song numerous times so I have to check it online (frankly speaking, I often can’t recognize the words in songs in my native tongue so it seems something must be wrong with my cognitive skills ;)).

Has it ever happened to you that you had liked the song at the beginning but after having checked the vocabulary you thought it’s a disaster? Or the other way round, the overall impression of the song was not very appealing at first but after actually hearing (not only listening to) the lyrics, you started liking it more?

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Lotha »

Song lyrics could be one of the most important things about a song for me. If I like a song already, and it has great lyrics, then I fall in love with it completely. If I don't like the lyrics then I cool off pretty quickly.
But yeah, often I have to check the lyrics online, too, sometimes the singers just mumble or sing too high to understand :D
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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by One Drew Remains »

The music and melody are the most important thing to me. It can sound amazing, and they can be singing about a gas station bathroom, and it won't matter. Look how philsophical Rush is. I only understand parts of it. But it's arguably some of the best music out there.

Obviously songs with great lyrics too are better. But not entirely necessary​ for me to enjoy it.
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Re: importance of lyrics

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One Drew Remains wrote:The music and melody are the most important thing to me. It can sound amazing, and they can be singing about a gas station bathroom, and it won't matter.
For me is the melody too. I only pay a little attention to the lyrics very much later.
And, honestly.. sometimes i find it difficult to interpret lyrics (even from my language)

But if i like the lyrics or feel related.. yes i'll probably like the song more.

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Re: importance of lyrics

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Lyrics are very important to me. They can really push a song to higher, more personal level. Even to the point where a great song with great lyrics can help pushing me to make life-changing decisions.

Cleverness is not that important to me and I don't think lyrics have to be super poetic. The words just have to fit the music (or the other way around, kinda like a soundtrack.) A song about a car station bathroom could be pretty awesome if the music fit that theme. Blink 182 doing an interpretation of Thomas Aquinas's Summa on the other hand would probably not be a good fit.
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Re: importance of lyrics

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Timotheus wrote:Lyrics are very important to me. They can really push a song to higher, more personal level. Even to the point where a great song with great lyrics can help pushing me to make life-changing decisions.
This. One Day remains was a kickass awesome guitar song with great vocals. Then I read the words and life changed.
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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Tigra »

Finally grabbed a computer...
Thank you for your comments. It is interesting to me how other people approach that.
The result seems to be 50/50 ;-)
I have two dedicated music-lovers around me. One of them does not understand a word in English (or maybe he knows “hello” and “thank you”), and the other one can communicate well in English. Neither of them cares about the content of a song at all and consider me a weirdo that it is so important to me. I HAVE to know what a song is about, especially if I like it melodically.
It happened to me once that I liked a song but did not understand a word. The content turned out to be so disgusting (encouraging men to abuse women) that I never ever played it again.
Lotha wrote:But yeah, often I have to check the lyrics online, too, sometimes the singers just mumble or sing too high to understand :D
:D
High five :D
Silvercreed wrote:And, honestly.. sometimes i find it difficult to interpret lyrics (even from my language)
Interpreting is even more advanced. What I mean here is the basic understanding of words (which does not concern native speakers of English, I suppose). Only if I know them, I may make an attempt to decipher the poetical meaning behind them (if there is any).
One Drew Remains wrote: It can sound amazing, and they can be singing about a gas station bathroom, and it won't matter.
Killed me :lol Wonder how it could actually sound :lol You probably have an idea for a hit ;-)
On the other hand, I quite like “Shipping Up to Boston” by Dropkick Murphy’s which is not a very poetical :lol But at least I know what it is about (or I can interpret it as a struggle with external obstacles and pursuing your goals, if you wish ;))
gbruin wrote:
Timotheus wrote:Lyrics are very important to me. They can really push a song to higher, more personal level. Even to the point where a great song with great lyrics can help pushing me to make life-changing decisions.
This. One Day remains was a kickass awesome guitar song with great vocals. Then I read the words and life changed.
That sound kind of scary.
Do you think musicians are aware of that responsibility?...
Honestly speaking, I experienced that as well and I don’t think it was very smart of me. I mean, the result was great, however, making a decision based on a piece of art does not sound very rational to me. Of course, there is no need to be always rational in life :headscratch

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by nagpo »

Lyrics are probably the least important part of a song. You don't need lyrics to make music. And if you listen to the radio that's proof enough that all you need is a catchy sound because none of those songs has any substantive lyrical content.

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Re: importance of lyrics

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Interesting thesis, I would say.
Based on what?

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by One Drew Remains »

Nago is correct in a way. I just saw a prog instrumental band open for Mastodon. No vocals, and it was good, and kept your attention. Russian Circles if you want to check it out.
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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Timotheus »

It's never fair to judge music based on what's on the radio, I think. Music and lyrics (poetry) are two different art forms. You indeed don't need lyrics to make music, but entwined they form a very powerful combination that transcendents music as just "music" or poetry/lyrics as just "poetry".
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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Silvercreed »

[/quote]
Timotheus wrote:Lyrics are very important to me. They can really push a song to higher, more personal level. Even to the point where a great song with great lyrics can help pushing me to make life-changing decisions.
The words just have to fit the music
You indeed don't need lyrics to make music, but entwined they form a very powerful combination that transcendents music as just "music" or poetry/lyrics as just "poetry".
I think this is the importance of a lyric can be. Blackbird is a fine example of it.. as there are many others.

And there are songs with no vocals, whose melody fits perfectly with the name of the song.
An example of it is: Violence by Anathema.

(and sorry if i wrote anything wrong in English) :lol

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Andy92 »

One Drew Remains wrote:Nago is correct in a way. I just saw a prog instrumental band open for Mastodon. No vocals, and it was good, and kept your attention. Russian Circles if you want to check it out.
The other side of this (which I think it what nagpo was more or less getting at) is that you can have a song with a super catchy melody where the lyrics are just garbage if you read them out of context of the song, but the song is still so catchy that most people don't care.

Think it depends on the style of music mostly. I think lyrics are important in some styles of music, but in others they tend to just be filler words to sing to the tune of the melody. And then there's the instrumental stuff like you mentioned.
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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Tigra »

To make it clear:
nagpo wrote:Lyrics are probably the least important part of a song. You don't need lyrics to make music.
This is absolutely true, just look at classics like Bach, Mozart, etc. Or more contemporarily - any soundtrack.

However, this:
nagpo wrote:And if you listen to the radio that's proof enough that all you need is a catchy sound because none of those songs has any substantive lyrical content.
sounds way to general for me.
Really none has any?

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by nagpo »

Tigra wrote:To make it clear:
nagpo wrote:Lyrics are probably the least important part of a song. You don't need lyrics to make music.
This is absolutely true, just look at classics like Bach, Mozart, etc. Or more contemporarily - any soundtrack.

However, this:
nagpo wrote:And if you listen to the radio that's proof enough that all you need is a catchy sound because none of those songs has any substantive lyrical content.
sounds way to general for me.
Really none has any?
I guess that's too much of an opinionated piece, but in my mind at least it's true.

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Tigra »

It can't be that bad, can it?
I really hope you're wrong although it's too much about personal taste to discuss it, I guess.

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Re: importance of lyrics

Post by Timotheus »

Depends what you define as pop. John Mayer is pop and he's written some amazing lyrics. Same with Ed Sheeran, like his music or not. Then there are artists like Lorde, Adele and Alicia Keys. The list really goes on the more I start thinking about it.

Granted, they're obviously no Leonard Cohens, but they write significant, meaningful music.
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Re: importance of lyrics

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Tigra wrote:
gbruin wrote:
Timotheus wrote:Lyrics are very important to me. They can really push a song to higher, more personal level. Even to the point where a great song with great lyrics can help pushing me to make life-changing decisions.
This. One Day Remains was a kickass awesome guitar song with great vocals. Then I read the words and life changed.
That sound kind of scary.
Do you think musicians are aware of that responsibility?...
Honestly speaking, I experienced that as well and I don’t think it was very smart of me. I mean, the result was great, however, making a decision based on a piece of art does not sound very rational to me. Of course, there is no need to be always rational in life :headscratch
I don't think it's scary. I think it was incredibly lucky that that album came to me when it did. I don't expect musicians to feel any obligation or responsibility for how someone else interprets their music. It's not on them to write things that are intentionally inspiring or meaningful to others. Every musician should write words and music that they love and enjoy themselves. If it then happens to resonate with a certain person, that's on that individual. People find inspiration and meaning in all sorts of places: philosophy, nature, art, relationships... For me, life changed immeasurably for the better when I listened to that song and album.

I don't expect everyone else to feel the way I did when I listened to One Day Remains for the very first time, and I don't have any expectation that Mark and Myles wrote, or should write, music and words to help me through this life. Thus there is no responsibility on them, but there is incredible appreciation and gratitude on my part. What those songs said to me at that time in my life is what elevates them as musicians and people in my eyes and ears above all the other great music and musicians that I love.
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Re: importance of lyrics

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gbruin wrote:I don't expect everyone else to feel the way I did when I listened to One Day Remains for the very first time, and I don't have any expectation that Mark and Myles wrote, or should write, music and words to help me through this life. Thus there is no responsibility on them, but there is incredible appreciation and gratitude on my part. What those songs said to me at that time in my life is what elevates them as musicians and people in my eyes and ears above all the other great music and musicians that I love.
I don't have those kinds of expectations as well, but yet somehow, album after album, AB just keeps writing the soundtrack of my life at the time, especially from a lyrical stance. I think that's one of the reasons why I always am willing to be pro for the direction AB is going for in the 2010s. Those albums and the lyrical content keeps reflecting my life, personally. I didn't ask for it from them and they have no obligations to do so, but it just naturally happens and that's why I always keep thinking, "AB just keeps writing the soundtrack of what my life is at the moment" and I love that from them since I can find something I can relate to and find solace in life that other people feel the same that I do, unintentionally, and that's always hard to find.

So about lyrics. I do care about lyrics in a song. Sometimes, you hear a certain lyric and you are like, "Yes, I want to keep hearing that over and over again and reflect upon the meaning of it," and that's why we look up to bands like Alter Bridge. Then again, you can just go ahead and be Blink-182 and write lyrics that does not mean much outside of the music. I mean here is a lyric from their big single, Bored to Death, from their latest album. "There's a stranger staring at the ceiling. Rescuing a tiger from a tree." What the heck does that mean? But the song had a certain charm to it and I enjoy it when hearing it on the radio from time to time and sing along to the song and there are similar radio songs where the lyrics makes no sense, but it just sound geninuely fun to hear.

Personally, I think that's why I personally seem have a hard time digesting prog rock/metal since the genre aren't really known for their lyrics that people can relate to. It's always seems to put more of an emphasis on the instrumentals and the wacky sounds and twists and turns of the song structures. I think that's why I really liked the Dream Theater self-titled album. They kept the instrumental wankery to a minimum and wrote some strong songs with strong lyrics to me. I love Rush, through and through, but Neil Peart was writing some pretty weird stuff from 2112 to the Hemispheres album. Take a song like Xanadu. It's got a pretty cool 5 minute instrumental intro, and the rest of the song musically sounds tremendous, worthy of one of the band's magnum opus, but the lyrics was about a guy trying to find a search for immortality and becomes cursed when he finds it. Permament Waves-onwards, though, the lyrics started becoming more relatiable through the eras from songs like The Spirit of Radio, Limelight, Subdivisions, Bravado, The Garden, etc.

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And just 2 commas

Post by gbruin »

anguyen92 wrote: I didn't ask for it from them and they have no obligations to do so, but it just naturally happens and that's why I always keep thinking, "AB just keeps writing the soundtrack of what my life is at the moment" and I love that from them...
You said it perfectly, angy.
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