The Game of Thrones Thread.

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Andy92
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Tue May 14, 2019 7:44 am

I agree that the problem with the scorpions wasn’t how ineffective they were this episode (it should be tough to hit a dragon out of the sky), the issue was how OP they were the episode before. The only thing that makes the situation make some slight sense was that in Ep 4, Rhaegal wasn’t flying all that fast and it was supposed to be a “surprise attack” (although I’m not sure why Dany wasn’t supposed to be aware of the Iron Fleet sitting there waiting). In this last episode, she uses the sun to her advantage like Timo said, and she never stops flying swiftly to make her more difficult to hit.

Is it executed the best? Definitely not. I do see what they were trying to do with it though. I think they thought having another one of her dragons die would lead more into her fit of rage and demise into madness.

As an aside...”Game of Thrones sucks” is becoming the new “I’ve never seen a single episode of Game of Thrones.”
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Fish Tacos » Tue May 14, 2019 9:53 am

I think they had another dragon die so that Jon has no easy way of challenging her now that he can ride them. But yeah, "my babies! :(" works too.
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MFGoT!!

Postby gbruin » Tue May 14, 2019 1:26 pm

Fish Tacos wrote:
gbruin wrote:The prophesy from Maggy the Frog said that Cersei would be killed by one of her brothers (the valonqar), didn't it?


Those were some nice expectations you had there. It would be a shame if someone were to...SUBVERT THEM!

You...you...You SUBVERTER!!

:lol

Yeah, like a lot of people, I'm just trying to find some ways to tie things together, in part b/c I haven't read the books (ain't got no time for fiction) so I'm really just asking questions. I realized those prophesies were never incorporated into the TV series, though the other parts of them are some of the few which did hold true in the TV series. So please do subvert away. I need all the info available.

As for all the fuss about how this season is progressing so rapidly and the long and elegantly developed character arcs that have become hyperacute angles, I've come to terms with it. I can't imagine how much money each of these latest episodes cost to make, and at some point the producers are just going to wrap things up so everyone can get on with their lives and careers. They are trying to close 8 years of a show (and several thousand pages of text and a few thousand more of unwritten meanings between the lines) with a thousand loopholes and loose ends in just 6 episodes, so of course it's going to come out super contracted and clunky and inelegant compared to how it was done for at least the first 4-5 seasons. I waited for 7 years for Jon Snow to know something and that was honestly longer than it needed to be for me. Part of the reason so many love the show is the care and patience that was employed in developing these characters and stories in the first place, so this season can't help but seem rushed and superficial and lazy. It's hard to wrap up an epic.

But then again, this is a show about a woman birthing dragons and an secret king whom everyone thinks is a bastard who gets stabbed to death but is revived by a hottie pseudowitch who once had smoke spew from her coot that murdered someone else while an army of dead walk around in subzero temperatures with insufficient clothing and try to make everyone else dead too. This show requires at least some level of willing suspension of disbelief. This season, I've suspended just a bit more and I'm enjoying it immensely. Not to tell anyone else how to deal, but it's a TV show and I'd recommend just rolling with what they give us. And I'm pretty damn curious to find out what they give us with regards to the newly Mad Queen and her murderous pet and her conflicted nephew and his cousin with the small sword, and I'm glad I don't have to wait another 3 seasons to get my answers. I need to get on with my life too.

The one thing I do regret some though is Tyrion. His character and story is the one most cheapened by this season.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Tue May 14, 2019 8:20 pm

Tyrion really hasn’t been that strong of a character since S5 comparing him to his S1-S4 writing. But I will say, his last goodbye with Jaime on Sunday’s episode was one of the best scenes on the show in a while.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby gbruin » Wed May 15, 2019 4:02 pm

Andy92 wrote:Tyrion really hasn’t been that strong of a character since S5 comparing him to his S1-S4 writing. But I will say, his last goodbye with Jaime on Sunday’s episode was one of the best scenes on the show in a while.

Agreed. That was pretty heartbreaking. I held out some hope it wouldn't be the last goodbye, until...
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Ubik » Wed May 15, 2019 5:04 pm

It's gonna be such a downbeat ending which is kind of remarkable for something so popular and long running. It was never gonna be a "and peace and goodwill reign over Westeros for generations!" type end, but still.

Would've never happened under Rhaegar.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Ubik » Fri May 17, 2019 6:33 pm

It's also now impossible to listen to Bringer of War without thinking it's about Dany :lol
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All in all, even after S8, I feel empty as hell.

Postby gbruin » Mon May 20, 2019 3:41 pm

Well, now what do I do? :mope
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby BSC » Mon May 20, 2019 3:51 pm

I appreciate that it is probably impossible to end the series in a way to satisfy everyone, and I know that people are obviously going to dislike the ending, as it won't live up to the eight years of fan theories and inner thoughts that people have had regarding Game of Thrones.

But I really don't have many good things to say about last night's episode. I felt like it was alright up until Jon killed Dany. I felt like Tyrion stole the episode and I really enjoyed every single scene he was in until Jon killed Dany. There were some strange moments, for example, why didn't The Unsullied hear Tyrion and Jon talking and get suspicious? Why did no one appear alarmed when Drogon started burning the place down? Why didn't Drogon kill Jon? Does Drogon have a conscience now, although he was the one to burn down all of the civilians last episode?

After Jon killed Dany it was just the blandest thing I probably ever watched. I genuinely starting laughing once Tyrion put Bran forwards as king. Most of the season has been spent looking into how Jon is likeable and loveable and how he would make a good king. But at no point during this entire series has there been any focus on how Bran would make a good king. I am aware that he is the three eyed raven and has knowledge of all of the history of Westeros, but we have seen absolutely nothing about his personal characteristics (spoilers - he has none), about his judgment or about whether he is a just person or not.

Didn't Bran say something like 'I can't be the lord - I'm the three eyed raven' last season? He can't be a lord, but being a king is absolutely fine. It just seemed like a curve ball for the sake of being a curve ball and subverting expectations.

I genuinely dislike the whole PC culture, but as someone with a disability it kind of bugged me a little bit about how Bran is 'Bran the Broken'. The characters have literally just named him king, but his defining characteristic is his disability? Not anything about why he would be a good king for example? Out of all of the things you could name the new king of Westeros out of, you name the disability. It just doesn't make sense. I try to think about something Bran has achieved that they could name him after, but I can't, because as far as I'm aware, he's not achieved nothing. Yeah, he became the third eyed raven, but it didn't contribute to the plot in any way at all.

After that it all felt a bit pointless. There's entire story plots of the series which seem to have led to absolutely nothing. The whole Jon's parentage story line (which has been building for the entire series) ultimately led to nothing. The White Walkers (which again has been building for the entire series) led to nothing apart from a cool battle.

I don't really have any concluding thoughts. To be honest, I was kind of expecting to be disappointed by the ending (even Kit Harrington said it's disappointing), but it's just so deflating and unsatisfying. I'm just relieved it's over now.

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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Ubik » Mon May 20, 2019 3:55 pm

I've liked this season a lot more than plenty of others, but I thought that was a disaster of an ending.

Starting promisingly with the tension, which just got thrown away and forgotten about. Everyone lives happily ever after (except the ones who are dead).
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby BSC » Mon May 20, 2019 4:23 pm

I agree with you Ubik. I think they could have done an entire season of Dany on the throne and I think it would have made for some great tension, but no, we'll settle for 30 minutes with her on the throne instead.

On that note, I think they could have done an entire season on the White Walkers alone following the falling of the wall. The entire series has been about winter is coming. Winter came and it couldn't even get past the first castle.

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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Mon May 20, 2019 6:42 pm

I didn’t mind how the show ended as far as where the characters ended up. I would’ve rather seen a full season dedicated to the White Walkers as well as a full season with the Last War too. In general though I didn’t mind seeing Bran on the throne, Sansa leading the north, and Jon with the Wildlings. The last scene with Jon leading the children into the forest was cool to see. Just wish Ygritte hadn’t died earlier though so Jon could have had a better ending.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Timotheus » Tue May 21, 2019 3:40 am

Season eight had its flaws, but the ending itself, the finale, felt like a good conclusion.

It's really cool to hate this season, but the show's been extremely flawed since season five, the moment they started to ignore the books. You always had to ignore the stupid, focus on the good and wonder how Martin was going to do it. This season was no different. Only more rushed.

I wish they'd given it more episodes, given us more slow moments like they did in episode two. I mostly wish they'd given the Long Night more meaning. I'm disappointed about all those things as well.

But I liked the ending. I think most characters ended up in a very logical place, in a place where I can see George Martin placing them as well. That's the most important to me.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Fish Tacos » Tue May 21, 2019 3:04 pm

Trying to figure out what the point of Jon's true lineage was. Seemingly the only impact it had was getting Varys killed. There was absolutely no point to tell his sisters that he was actually their cousin instead of the half brother, and if that was truly what drove a wedge between him and Dany enough to make her go apeshit on King's Landing then it's somewhat malicious for Bran to have "left it up to Jon" knowing full well that outcome would lead to being crowned King himself.

Happy that Bron got Highgarden I guess but was there any point to making such an unqualified candidate Master of Coin? Or was that simply so we could have the joke about ships vs brothels? Dragon burning the throne was...symbolic of something I guess? Cool visual, but didn't make much sense for the animal to know what the throne was or its significance to Dany being murdered, especially if it let Jon live. The Unsullied, raised to not care if they live or die and incapable of starting their own families, wanting revenge against Tyrion and Jon but accepting a compromise to avoid war rang hollow. Apparently Sansa's a badass leader now - guess I missed that transition. I guess I should be happy she's protecting the North as an independent kingdom and getting special treatment from her brother? Arya becomes Dora the Explorer. Jon goes back to take the black on a wall that no longer needs to defend against Wildlings nor Wights.

The conversation where "Why did you murder all those innocent people" gets followed up with "Cersi was using them as a mercy shield against me" and Jon doesn't say "the city had already surrendered" or "you could have killed Cersi directly" or anything else that actually addresses the problem and they just move onto the next thing. Guess the writers couldn't think of a justification other than "nothing frees you from tyranny like immolation!"

Fairly bland ending IMO.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Tue May 21, 2019 4:08 pm

A lot of authors write outlines for their books before writing the actual books so they can keep their order of key events straight. I feel like the show writers were probably given outlines for the last two books that GRRM had written, and they were left to fill in the gaps of how events transpired to hit the major plot points. I don’t think Bran becoming king and Jon living out his days up north are too far-fetched...the story just wasn’t fleshed out well enough compared to how it will (or should) be in the books.
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Beers with Tormund and frisbee with Ghost seems fun. And if Ygritte had a sister...

Postby gbruin » Wed May 22, 2019 2:25 am

Opinions...Was Jon just escorting the Wildlings back north of the wall or is he going to live among them?
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Wed May 22, 2019 2:58 pm

I think he planned to live among them. His exile up north was less about him being in the Night’s Watch (there’s no more threat beyond the wall) and more about allowing him to live out his days somewhere in peace.
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I guess he knows something after all.

Postby gbruin » Thu May 23, 2019 6:16 am

I like that. Or I like that he just said F it to his "sentence" and left. Who's gonna come after him?
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby Andy92 » Thu May 23, 2019 9:53 am

Right, no one is gonna know any different anyways. The way all of the Wildlings were waiting on him to arrive makes me think they had no plans on leaving him at Castle Black from the beginning. Jon Snow kind of has the anti-Aragorn story. Rightful king lives out life as a ranger instead of taking back his throne.
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Re: The Game of Thrones Thread.

Postby gbruin » Fri May 24, 2019 11:29 am

That's a good point - I didn't think about why they were all loitering around the place. Pretty cool that they recognized and appreciated what he went through to protect them. Too bad his own family couldn't do the same for him.

We all could use a real life leader who doesn't want that level of power.
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